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dual cooling

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IMPERIALGTR View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IMPERIALGTR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: dual cooling
    Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 7:43pm

i could do with the how to's of instaling dual cooling.

can i use a normal 90degree brass water piece? say off a head, and just drill a hole in the pump on the opposite the oem one? or do i need to buy a kit? i like the diy approach if possible, i have a bored nozzle so i can use the bilge syphol hole to go through the firewall but where abouts do i plumb it into? i will also need another p*sser!
 
good tips will be much appreciated, thanks in advance, adam.Wink


Edited by IMPERIALGTR - 31/Jul/2010 at 10:52am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote keith t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 7:49pm
not needed in UK in my opinion unless you going full out performance ski
 
risk of dual cooling in winter is siezure due to lack of heat not too much heat
 
why do youu think you need dual cooling ?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IMPERIALGTR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 7:55pm

i was thinking that my head was feeling very hot, but ill compare it to my mates next time we are out. i take it if you run dual cooling in cold water the engine never really heats up?

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Post Options Post Options   Quote keith t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 8:01pm
Originally posted by IMPERIALGTR

 i take it if you run dual cooling in cold water the engine never really heats up?

yeah thats right
 
has your head two inlet/outlets ?
 
you can open up holes in p*ssers to let more water flow thru if you want to lower temp a bit
 
but check all waterlines arent blocked first
 
the head should get hot, but not scalding hot if that makes sense
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Post Options Post Options   Quote r32to330d Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 8:08pm
Originally posted by keith t

not needed in UK in my opinion unless you going full out performance ski
 
risk of dual cooling in winter is siezure due to lack of heat not too much heat
 
why do youu think you need dual cooling ?
agree 100%
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IMPERIALGTR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/Jul/2010 at 8:12pm
yea i bored my p*sser to  6.5mm as i didnt have a 7 and my head has both outlets plumbed
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 7:56pm
If your engine feels too hot you have a problem, fitting dual cooling to it is like trying to polish a turd. Its not needed in our climate.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kev.t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 8:00pm
Originally posted by QJS

fitting dual cooling to it is like trying to polish a turd.
LOLLOLLOLyou can't polish a turd, but you can roll one in glitterEmbarrassed
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 8:14pm
My blaster kept overheating and popping orings .stripped head checked ALL lines and elbows for blockages ,all brass fittings ,checked water jacket aswell.did this more than once. put in duel cooling problem solved. Guess there's something wrong with my engine then ?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kev.t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 9:19pm
blaster, same motor as jet but heavier ski(engine works harder) and more WOT runs= more heat.
if you're racing your s/j then yeah duel cooling. if not and it's getting hot, check what you've got before "polishing the turd" so to speak.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote IMPERIALGTR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 9:31pm
but i like polishing turds kev, ill have to try your glitter idea!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/Jul/2010 at 9:59pm
Blaster would overheat within a few minutes p*sser water was scolding hot checked engine ,lines ,pump for any blockages etc .
My turd (sj) runs nice with duel cooling have a p*sser running to tray to keep my feet warm in the winter and keep an eye ( or feel) on water temp no problems being to cold yet
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kawasaki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 8:53am
I run it on my kwack ....i get a really good flow !
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kev.t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 9:43am
Originally posted by mattt

Blaster would overheat within a few minutes p*sser water was scolding hot checked engine ,lines ,pump for any blockages etc .
My turd (sj) runs nice with duel cooling have a p*sser running to tray to keep my feet warm in the winter and keep an eye ( or feel) on water temp no problems being to cold yet
i hear what you're saying matt. just be mindfull when in the colder months when water temp going into engine is 20+ degrees colderWink probably be ok on the blaster as the engine works harder for longer periods, don't know about the jet though.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 8:36pm
At the end of the day if your not having overheating issues don't worry about it , I have used my sj when snow was settled on the ground. I just can't see how the engine will run too cold . I'm no expert I cook pies for a living but the small amount of water in the jacket compared to friction of pistons etc seems like no contest to me. other benefits are if one line gets blocked and you don't notice line two is good insurance . I'm running duel cooling cos I was told to when I picked my tbm up in the USA . They new it was for freestyle . I think ( this is my understanding not what I was told ) the tbm in some cases does not create enough pressure for the cooling line pick up to feed the engine properly but I stand to be corrected    
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 9:06pm
Just for the record the TBM and R&D pump cones raise the pump pressure not lower it.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MAD RICK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 9:08pm
Me & Lisa both run duel cooling Thumbs Up 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote keith t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 9:09pm
Ahh but Rick thats cos you are HOT STUFF LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MAD RICK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 9:23pm
Originally posted by keith t

Ahh but Rick thats cos you are HOT STUFF LOL
Have you been talking to Lisa Wink LOL 
I think it all depends on what mods you have, how your engine is set up & what your engine builder sugests is the best - I was told my setup needed it Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Quote SuperDan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29/Jul/2010 at 10:04pm
I was told if im running a blowsion large pump hub cone thing i need dual cooling. 

Even in the hot weather weve had lately, my "hot" hands arnt hot.. it does keep engine temps down. 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 10:31am
by putting a tbm in a pump you are changing the flow, so maybe while pressure is increased it may also change where that pressure is in the pump or the way the water flows through it.i run stubby cone and a bored nozzle, all this would change pump pressure flow etc? it maybe more effeciant at pushing water out the back but not so good at pushing it up 90degree brass fittings ,just a thought . maybe thats why duel cooling is suggested im sure some clever maths/ science type people could work it out unfortunatly im not one of them
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Post Options Post Options   Quote kev.t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 3:37pm
not getting into it now matt, but pressure acts in all directions equally. ie the pressure coming off the back of your prop is equal all the way untill it leaves the pump nozzle.Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 4:12pm
ok. i thought flowing water took the path of least resistance ie easier to flow out the back than go up a small hole and round 90degree bend. but i think im getting way out of my depth now
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 7:27pm
I hate to see people spending money on skis they don't need to or for the wrong reasons so here are my guidlines based on 20 years experience and not on theory.
Stock stroke freestyle skis do not need dual cooling unless they run certain drypipes.
Freestyle skis with stroker engines would be better with dual cooling due to the higher piston speed.
If a stock stroke engine with a B pipe is overheating there is a problem somewhere, dual cooling may stop it overheating but the problem will still be there.
There are other reasons to play around with dual cooling but you don't need it if your engine is stock stroke with a B pipe, save your money and spend it on petrol.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 7:30pm
Originally posted by mattt

by putting a tbm in a pump you are changing the flow, so maybe while pressure is increased it may also change where that pressure is in the pump or the way the water flows through it.i run stubby cone and a bored nozzle, all this would change pump pressure flow etc? it maybe more effeciant at pushing water out the back but not so good at pushing it up 90degree brass fittings ,just a thought . maybe thats why duel cooling is suggested im sure some clever maths/ science type people could work it out unfortunatly im not one of them


I think if dual cooling was needed TBM would have it on thier website or in the instructions.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 7:48pm
Forgot to mention that Oggy (and plenty of others) has been using a TBM pump cone for 3 years on two different 760's and neither of them run too hot.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mattt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 8:17pm
That's me told then !told you them clever people would be along sooner or later Ps what are instructions for ?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote QJS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 8:27pm
Don't think I'm having a go Matt, thats certainly not the case I just hate to see people doing stuff to ski's for the wrong reasons.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stow Skiers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 8:29pm
Originally posted by SuperDan

I was told if im running a blowsion large pump hub cone thing i need dual cooling. 

Even in the hot weather weve had lately, my "hot" hands arnt hot.. it does keep engine temps down. 
 
 
Hot Hands........this time of year........are you sure Dan.........LOLLOLWink
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Post Options Post Options   Quote figbob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30/Jul/2010 at 8:31pm
i have a heavily ported 760 which was , in my opinion running a little hot, and without a large pump core, the water coming out the p*sser was hot! i dual cooled it and its seems to be running slightly cooler which i'm happy about. 
 
i ski with a guy with a 701/head/b pipe, all set up the same and his is way hotter than mine! the way it steams when you take off the hood is concerning and thats without a flow control valve!
 
i have another mate running an all singing ported 760 with a type 9/tbm/dual cooling and 40 horses of nitrous and his engine is quite cool to touch!
 
 
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